Don’t like Trump? Blame Christie
By Brian Kirwin | Friday, April 22nd, 2011 |Donald Trump is making waves in Republican circles as he explores a Presidential Run. He’s attacking Obama head-on in ways that most Republicans don’t dare. He’s got a bit of Reagan in him, with highpowered rhetoric, but delivered without the “fire and brimstone” tone that turns most voters off.
Trump has a page in his book that Romney, Huckabee, Pawlenty and everyone else hasn’t done well – He’s got a Class A communications style.
He says things most candidates won’t and things that make consultants cringe.
When asked about if he would’ve gone into Libya, he said this:
TRUMP: Somebody said, what would be your theory or what would you do in terms of Libya? I’d do one thing. Either I’d go in and take the oil or I don’t go in at all. We can’t be the policeman for the world.
CROWLEY: You’d just take their oil?
TRUMP: Absolutely. I’d take the oil. I’d give them plenty so they can live very happily. I would take the oil. You know, in the old days, Candy –
CROWLEY: Well, wait, we can’t go –
TRUMP: – Candy, Candy, in the old days, when you have a war and you win, that nation is yours.
What politician would say that?
To me, it sounds a lot like this:
The teacher responded by saying that she has a master’s degree and that her current salary isn’t compensating her for the value of her higher education as well as her experience.
To that, the governor responded: “Well, you know then that you don’t have to do it.”
That was New Jersey’s Chris Christie.
Trump’s tapping into something that would be Chris Christie’s base, the “tell it like it is” crowd. I think if Christie entered the race, Trump would be done. The two would lock horns, and Trump wouldn’t do well.
I think Trump can walk over most of the other candidates if he wants to.
Now, the birther thing.
51% of Republican primary voters think Obama was born outside the United States. The leading candidate among those voters is Mike Huckabee.
Huckabee won the Iowa caucuses four years ago. Trump is likely a rockstar in a northern state like New Hampshire.
Trump is targeting Huckabee’s Iowa base with the only issue that he probably can, and if it works, he walks into “home turf” New Hampshire, folks known to like their straight talkers.
Winning Iowa and New Hampshire together could end the race, especially with Trump’s finances. I don’t see any current candidate that can stop that train. Romney got whupped by McCain. He’ll be breakfast for Trump.
Only Christie has the communications style to edge into Trump’s political oxygen. Without Christie in the race, Donald Trump has a real shot to coast into the nomination.
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The right wants to jeer him. The left wants to censor him. Moderates usually want both. Brian Kirwin is a political consultant and public relations strategist in Virginia Beach with a lightning-rod flair. Brian also serves on the VB Arts & Humanities Commission and frequently appears on Hampton Roads theatrical stages, if only to prove that all actors aren’t liberals. Kirwin’s columns stir up debate and hit the political scene with no punches pulled.
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87 Responses to "Don’t like Trump? Blame Christie"
Wow. What you’re saying then is that if Christie doesn’t get in, Obama is a walk for re-election. Trump can’t beat him.
Don’t you think some of Trump’s baggage, particularly his marital history, might have some impact with religiously-oriented Republican voters?
I agree with you that Romney — who I think would be the toughest candidate for Obama in the general — can’t win the Republican nomination. Romneycare alone is enough to defeat him.
Steve, most Presidents get a second term if they want it. Those that don’t have primary challengers and election year recessions.
You guys heard that Kenny Klinge is working for Trump right?
Trump is definitely a wild card. But who knows it might take someone totally like him to different to beat the Obama Machine. He won’t need public financing in the general for sure.
Brian K,
You do not see “The Donald” having a problem with how he changes wives? Once the old one shows signs of wear, time to get a new one. He treats wives like most citizens treat pairs of shoes.
How well do you think his personal life fits in with the Republican base’s expectations? Newt Gingrich faces the same problems.
Even worse, Leftists treat state budgets like The Donald treats wives. When they have used up one state’s budget, they “migrate” to a conservatively run state to start the process all over again.
BK It’s not only Christie’s “absence” it’s the “presence” of Boehner and McConnell acting timidly which is also fueling Trump. If Congressional Repubs get rolled on the debt ceiling this will increase flight to Trump.
David, no. I don’t think it’s as relevant, because Trump isn’t toting any social conservative banner. He might lose in that base, but no one needs a majority to win the early caucuses and primaries.
Valentinus, you make a good point, but your point impacts all candidates in the field. Christie hurts Trump the most.
BK
I agree but you contended in a previous post that Christie was definitely going to sit out 2012. Are you changing your mind? If Christie stays out then I would still think Trump benefits relatively more from Repub fecklessness. It will be interesting to see what the fence sitter Romney does. If he changes to a more combative critical stance, then Trump is driving the debate at least.
I think he’s staying out, but some disagree.
Brian K,
You do not think it is relevant? Was it relevant when Bill Clinton was President?
Let’s hear what Donald Trump has to say about a comparison of him with Bill Clinton:
“Can you imagine how controversial I’d be? You think about him with the women. How about me with the women? Can you imagine?”
David, I’m not sure you noticed, but Clinton won.
Brian,
Yeah, he won twice. But both of those wins came before Monica Lewinsky didn’t they?
Both of those wins came with Clinton running as a Democrat and the Republicans tried to impeach him.
Brian, on the poll …
#1 – PPP interviewed 419 ‘usual primary voters’ in IOWA. Iowa is the ONLY PPP primary poll where this question was asked – no other state.
#2 – The folks driving up the numbers were mostly Palin & Huck’s folks. When cross tab’d, 13% of McCain, 10% of Daniels & 28% of Pawlenty supporters believe Obama was not US born.
The headlines SHOULD read: 72% of Huck and 67% of Palin supporters in Iowa believe Obama wasn’t born in the U.S. Of course if you printed it that way, who would be surprised?
Also, isn’t it a bit of a stretch to compare Christie’s very reasonable comment with Trump’s idiotic babble?
While we agree the wife thing is likely not a deal breaker, primary voters might care:
- The federal recipient that got the most Trump cash in the last 20 years was … the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee – nearly $100K;
- John Kerry, Ted Kennedy, Charlie Rangel, Tom Daschle, and Harry Reid routinely received campaign contributions.
- He wrote a book in which he said the US needs Canada style universal health care.
- He flipped on the abortion issue.
- He endorsed a ‘millionaires tax’.
- He belittled Ronald Reagan, “I’m not sure there’s anything behind that smile.”
- He said Nancy Pelosie was “the best” and Obama “the greatest”.
If Rove is bomb tossing this stuff on Greta’s show, it’s a pretty good indication the Republican Party intends to take him out if primary votes don’t.
Jay D,
Let me let you in on a little secret about Mr. Kirwin – he doesn’t write a damn thing without a purpose.
My interpretation of this post? The GOP better get serious about this nomination – and quick. I think we have nearly 18 possible candidates and none of them cause me to even slightly feel like charging a hill.
JayD
The news keeps moving. The latest from the front. Krauthammer says he was “surprised at Trump’s calm and gracious demeanor” when Trump called him. Dana Perino said she was impressed with the “crisp way” The Donald is now talking and what an improvement he has made.
Remember this is the same media that was impressed with the crease in Obama’s pants.
JR
Exactly. The Repubs are clearly assuming it will either be Obama coasting or Obama roasting and therefore nothing that they need to lift a finger about. They are nor prepared to wage and win even a modest fight.
With all this interest in Trump, who thinks voters care whether a person has a background of morals, integrity or character anymore? The moral majority is asleep or no longer exists.
The GOP better wake up now. If there isn’t a solid champion to put up against Obama, we will have four more years of him. Yawn…..
By the way, I have friends calling me from all over the country to ask my opinion of Trump. They seem to be really impressed with him. I tell them he says what Republicans can’t get away with saying but he is a media –o– and may run independent if he runs at all. No one can really tell about Trump except he’s going to fire somebody, it may or may not be Obama, but probably not.
JR, Ha! So true; no one engages … or enrages!, quite like The Kirwin!
Val, surprised because Krauthammer “…was prepared for a gale of abuse, because I’ve been really tough on him, and he would have been within his rights to do it,” Krauthammer also said the call didn’t change his views “on the unseriousness of his candidacy. But as a person, I thought more highly of him… because of the gracious way and the calm and courteous way he discussed the issues.”
Guess that IS an improvement over CK’s last week’s comment, “Trump is the Al Sharpton of the GOP”!
Its just a hunch but me thinks Trumpo and Christie are natural allies.. Maybe Trump is laying bare in preparation for a run either with or for Christie.. They just seem like natural allies.
While I agree that Trump and Christie are probably fairly simpatico politically, I can’t imagine Trump agreeing to be VP or a stalking horse for Christie. They wouldn’t even make a likely ticket since NJ and NY are too close and they might not carry either state. I think BK is on the right track and is seeing what Trump has seen.
“Trump is likely a rockstar in a northern state like New Hampshire”
The New Hampshire GOP primary polls reported by RCP all show Romney leading by 15-30%; the second Trump or any of the other upstarts (Bachman, Palin, etc.) start building any meaningful momentum, establishment Republicans will start flocking to the leading “serious” candidate (Romney, Daniels, Pawlenty, etc.) in an all out panic.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2012/president/nh/new_hampshire_republican_presidential_primary-1581.html
If Boehner and McConnell keep up with their antics even the “establishment Repubs” may get disgusted or dwindle in numbers.
McDonnell, do you feel the call yet? I hope so.
I wouldn’t get too worked up about the poll OR Iowa right now. Huckabee won it in ’08, followed by Mitt and Fred Thompson, with McCain (the eventual nominee) taking but 13% of the caucus vote. As a predictor for eventual Republican nominee, Iowa doesn’t have that great of a track record. The caucus is almost a year from now – plenty of time for even Iowans to get familiar with other candidates (like Mitch Daniels) and the media to tire of Trump stories.
Turbo – I sure hope not!! Gov. McDonnell and John Edwards also share similar communication styles …and I wouldn’t call them allies.
BTW, if anyone wants access to this PPP poll, here’s a link. Download a pdf of the 4/19 poll by clicking on: 4/19 Iowa Republican Poll.
http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/surveys.asp?@spdT=ECF791E062CD404AAB75
Mike Gonzales, Thxs for the link! Interesting … in the WMUR/UNH poll, taken before Trump came out w/ the birther nonsense, he was barely on the radar ~ polling at 3% vs. Romney’s 40%.
The long form birth cert issue will not go away as long as poll data shows it works. Its like bad medicine that covers up the symptoms but provides relief.. you take it until the underlying cause is better understood well enough to treat the problem.
Hold your nose, more is certain to come of it down the road. There are simply way too many dem and gop establishment types too chicken to go where Trump fear not tread and it will swing the spotlight his way I predict for some time.. Bear in mind, this is bait. “Trump For America” wants media attention when they want it and tooting the birther issue will force media to pay even more attention on short notice to him while they check out his past.
His financial dealings good and bad are fodder and he wants the scrutiny. Remember, the ole briarpatch.. Trump ALWAYS lands on his feet. If the media do an indepth media war on his financials he will crush every other candidate by it being shown he knows how to make huge sums of money, knows his way around lending and borrowing for good or bad, knows how to navigate out of financial armegeddon all the while making enormous donations to thousands of good causes and paying, or evading? taxes. And forget not that he has a lot of experience with global trade. He knows enough about dealing with chinese and saudis to make every other gop contenders head spin.
Just wait until the casino night fund raisers start..
Turbo, I’m curious; clarification please?
Exactly where does Trump go? What is the issue that “gop establishment types [are]too chicken to go where Trump fear not tread …”?
JayD
I don’t wish to intrude on your dialogue with Turbo but your second query astonishes me. What have the GOP establishment types discussed at all? They seemed totally on board with all things Obama until the Tea Party got them to oppose Obamacare. They still seem comfortably back in the Bob Michel lazy chair speaking softly. Look at the way that all the establishment GOP candidates were talking before Trump. I certainly agree that it is unclear where Trump will go with these or other topics (except trade) but anywhere he does go will be an area where the GOP establishment was too chicken or unwilling to go.
You know what? I’m beginning to long for the days when Newt was Speaker rather than a goofy POTUS wannabe.
I used to be a “birther” until I closely looked at my ORIGINAL birth certificate from 1959. No seal guys. But my birth certificate I ordered in 2008 has a seal, so it’s something they started doing later. It’s embarrassing.
I want someone who will have real answers for our real problems; economy, jobs, energy independence, national security, national debt, etc., etc.. Trump has some good points but let him throw his money around on more important issues.
I agree Kathy, there are other real issues that deserve more attention. Until those issues poll better with mainstream and the media they glue their eyeballs to, Trump will use what pulls the msm ratings up and even if it annoys some folks I am confident the msm ratings benefit anytime Trump brings up anything controversial.
My nickname has a purpose. It embarrassed me as a teenager but then later it opened a lot of doors. I interviewed at Ford and Chrysler engineering close to 30 yrs ago and much to my surprise I was marched to a few unexpected executive offices only to have Lee Iacocca and a few others ask how I got the name.. It opened doors. The birthcert is doing that for Trump. and its working far better than anyone wants it to.
JayD, Where does Trump go? Anywhere he damn well pleases and wherever that is the red carpet is rolled out. He is good for ratings. He is not worried about rubbing the gop establishment leadership or asking out of order questions. Boohoo Boehner, McConnell and the Rinocracy have no ability to reign him in and he can broach any topic he wants to without fear of retribution or losing his crack at being chosen for grooming for higher position. The establishment is Trumps bitch if he so chooses merely because the establishment are like deer frozen in the headlights.. I call em chickenshit but rino’s can call em what they want.
Valentinus, no intrusion at all. I’m just curious to know the specific issues folks believe are not being addressed by other GOP candidates? Is it trade; economic growth; national defense; energy, Obamacare? What is Trump addressing that other candidates are not? Would appreciate anyone’s response on this question – thanks!
Turbo, Ha! In your dreams! Looks to me the GOP rolled UP that red carpet and Trump is on his own making a damn fool out of himself.
Call me too optimistic, but I still believe the American people and GOP voters are smarter than the media thinks. Sure, we enjoy a good sideshow – and a car wreck! And yes, outrageous gets the ratings, which makes $$$s for networks. We might tune into WWW, reality shows, and gritch Randy & Paula are too nice; but in the end, we like our presidents to be … presidential. Trump is not only offering up outrageous idiocies, he’s vulgar and offensive.
BTW, heard the latest? Fox News is first out of the box w/ Trump’s VP pick – Nicole “Snooki” Polizzi.!!
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2011/04/23/cowboy-libertarian-trump-snooki-ticket-surges-past-obama-biden/
I don’t know if it’s the Jerry Springer, reality TV, soap opera mentality that has dumbed down America or it’s that people need controversy to liven up their dull or stressful lives. If Trump wants to be a serious candidate he needs to stop being controversial like he has been for decades and have some serious thought processes on what I’ve stated above. Turbo, I am not a label, rino, whatever. I could care less about labels. I do care we have become a silly society that loves controversy.
I remember when the world held us in high regard. Now we owe every one and have a leader, voted into office by the majority, that the world knows is in a job over his head. He could at least pick great people to give him advise and take that advise but it’s clear he can’t even do that.
If we can’t find a strong frontrunner soon, Trump will be there to step up to the plate. I bet the Democrats are salivating.
JayD,
You are right. There are position papers on every topic imaginable. For example, Obama has given multiple speeches on deficit reduction. So what! When he speaks you can see he is mouthing the words. But oh when he attacks business or “tax cuts” then you see his energy rise. The GOP establishment candidates don’t seem to have any energy for anything (I make a slight exception for Newt). All of them had pollsters develop the positions. What exactly would any of them fight for? Beats me. On the other hand, everyone can see that Trump is really ticked off by our trade practices for example. He looks engaged so you think he might actually do something. Some years bland milksop is in fashion. I don’t 2012 is one of those years. I would prefer the Repub party to be engaged rather than some person flying in from the sidelines but it doesn’t look good at this point.
Kathy & Valentinus, ditto 100% word for word.
JayD, Chickenshit in the vernacular “WWII troop slang for military bureaucratic bullshit. The word implies that the regulations in question are so silly and trifling that they don’t measure up to the level of bullshit. Subsequently, the word came to be merely an intensification of chicken.
In life and death matters, soldiers relied on their common sense and ignored the chickenshit regulations their superiors foisted upon them whenever possible.”
When I call gop leadership Chickenpoop and most gop electeds (now excluding Rigell to my delight), I mean it in the above context.
As for trumps red carpet, no its not coming from the limp wristed GOP, its the media. The msm loves ratings and will do just about anything to raise them.
As for what the other gop hopefuls are not addressing, for one, American exceptionalism. When Trump says we should stick our own pipe in the ground and pay ourselves back for oil after winning a war I bet a lot of folks that will never blog here agree. I also bet a lot of those people don’t give a rats a$$ if the candidate is gop or dem as more folks are falling into the neither party camp. And they want action.. NOW
Oh come on! Trump is the Christine O’donnell of this election cycle. The establishment GOP is already pulling out the dirty linen concerning his multiple eminent domain and bankruptcy issues. Heck even Malkin is on the Ditch the Don playlist. It can only go down hill from here.
Bob McDonnell for President.
If Donald Trump gets the nomination…haha…Obama will win 75-25, winning 49 of 50 states.
Ditto X2 Kathy.
Turbo, no translations required. Donald Trump IS entertaining. And while he’s certainly not chickensh*t, he’s completely full of sh*t.
Since no one wants to offer up Trumps policy positions, here’s his platform as best as I can locate: BIRTHER ISSUE: “If you look at the Republican Party, 75 percent of [GOP voters] think there is something to it …” LIBYA: “…go in and take the oil — I would just go in and take the oil …We’re a bunch of babies — we have wars and we leave — we go in, we have wars, we lose lives, we lose money, and we leave, … I would go in and take the oil and I’d clean up everything.” IRAQ: “So, in the old days, you know when you had a war, to the victor belong the spoils. You go in. You win the war and you take it.” [Stephanopoulos]: “So, we steal an oil field?” [Trump]: “Excuse me. You’re not stealing. Excuse me. You’re not stealing anything. You’re taking– we’re reimbursing ourselves– at least, at a minimum, and I say more.” CHINA: Well, I think I’m getting the votes because …of … my stance on China. I’ve made a lot of money with China — I’ve done deals with China, which I’ll be exposing some day in the very near future, perhaps — and I’m very proud to expose it, …The fact is, people know that I will do a great job in stopping China from ripping us off, which is what they’re doing.” Trump would also impose a 25% [some days he likes 40% better] import tariff if they refuse to appreciate the yuan faster. OPEC: “People know that I will do a great job with OPEC and I will stop this carnage . . . in terms of what they’re doing with oil, what they’re doing with our gasoline prices,”. EMPLOYMENT: “We’d bring the jobs back home — by putting [in] incentives to have people employ our people — not to employ people from India, China, Mexico, and other places, WALL STREET: No additional regulations, otherwise, Wall Street wouldn’t be able to compete with London, Zurich, and Hong Kong. DEFENSE SPENDING: increase defense spending, build better weapons, and have better intelligence so that the US military can achieve its goals with fewer human casualties.IMMIGRATION: Militarize the border. For illegal aliens already in the US, decide on a case-by-case basis who stays or is deported or jailed. PAKISTAN: Cut off all financial aid to Pakistan until they handover Osama. TAXES: Simplify the tax code and make it fairer. [Wow; profound!] OIL PROFITS: “Tax the oil companies into oblivion” since they’re making so much money now. Would he support the same TAXES on REAL ESTATE, if property was as ‘hot’ as oil? “Yeah, but the fact is it’s not hot like oil.” [A NATIONAL real estate tax?]
Turbo, after he strokes you nicely and tells you just how exceptional you are … which of his policy positions you gonna support first?
Valentinus: Trump may be ticked off by trade practices, but has no problem buying Chinese products; pretty sure USG would sell him all the US-made wallboard he needs.
Seriously, it’s early; no one – other than us poli-geeks & newshounds – is paying attention this early; not even Iowans! Check out Daniels, an interesting guy; there should be at least a couple of Cavuto interviews with him on Fox or YouTube.
Kathy, I trust when GOP primary voters get serious about this campaign, we’ll wind up with a strong nominee that fits the bill. I’m not sure, however, which came first… did Springer dumb down Americans? Or did dumb Americans create Springer?
Donald Trump calls Americans ‘defeated and in need of real leadership’. Defeated??!! We’re bruised up but far, far from folding and we’re doing exactly what Americans ALWAYS do when knocked down – pick ourselves back up, dust off, and get back to the business of rebuilding lives. THAT is the fount of America’s exceptionalism … our pit bull determination to make things work.
And I don’t buy into the myth the world no longer holds us in high regard. That’s Obama’s line, MSNBC’s line, democrat party’s line. Anyone who travels outside US borders or has cross-world relationships will tell you its simply BS ~ well, OK …maybe true in France!
Every college break my house fills with young people – amazing, sharp, smart, optimistic, ambitious, hardworking, determined and generous spirited young’ns. I have ABSOLUTELY no doubts – if given a fair shot (and not an unsustainable fiscal burden) – they will take America forward in ways we haven’t even thought off. Chin up!
JayD,
We all know that Trump is Not a politician with poll tested position papers, he is filling a void of commitment on the Repub side. That’s what BK and JR are alluding to. The Left burns for a NewAge statism as silly conceptually as it is ugly practically. Nevertheless they are committed to it fervently. Repub primary voters may gravitate to someone, anyone, who shows that he or she thinks the country is worth fighting for. Again as BK warns, things can happen very quickly once the primary season begins.
As for Daniels I just don’t see in a media age how he stands on the platform with Obama. He also seems hesitant and slightly tin eared. A perfect OMB director.
JayD, dude.. I have traveled the globe and have enough friendships outside of the US who indicate we are indeed becoming the laughingstock of the modern industrialized world. We does not include all of us but it include large numbers.. enough to vote in the teleprompter codependent community organizing harvard lawyer (who never tried a case) socialist commander in chief who.. aint show’n the birth certificate cause he sez so.
Turbo, since you duck all direct questions, shall we infer you don’t agree with any of Trump’s positions or solutions to the problems America faces… but his communication style DOES gives you goose bumps?
Laughingstock? Just because you say it’s so, doesn’t MAKE it so. There’s a reason global heads of state look at THIS young republic for leadership; the world sends its best & brightest to OUR universities; immigrants & expatriates flock HERE; and young people across the globe covet & mirror AMERICAN style, music, etc. – and it sure as hell isn’t because we’re a laughingstock. Sorry – ain’t buying what your sell’n.
Valentinus: American anger put Obama in the oval office – not democrats. Sure we want to go there again? If Daniels isn’t your choice (not sure he’s mine either), there are others. At this critical moment we absolutely need OMB types (like Ryan) managing the books.
Obamacare was just enough of an overreach that it mobilized taxpayers & jet fueled free-market principals movements.
And we can all thank the democrats for shooting New Age statism in its collective foot!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalking_horse
A stalking horse is a person who tests a concept with someone or mounts a challenge against them on behalf of an anonymous third party. If the idea proves viable and/or popular, the anonymous figure can then declare their interest and advance the concept with little risk of failure. If the concept fails, the anonymous party will not be tainted by association and can either drop the idea completely or bide their time and wait until a better moment for launching an attack.
Trump gave Rahm $50,000.00 towards his Chicago mayoral campaign.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/20/magazine/20Emanuel-t.html?_r=1&pagewanted=2
Illinois law placed no limits on political contributions until Jan. 1, and Emanuel made the most of the opportunity. He collected more than 70 contributions of $50,000 or more, accounting for roughly half the $10.5 million he raised by the end of last year. Those contributions alone were more than was raised by all of the other mayoral candidates combined.
Many of his biggest contributors live outside Chicago. He received large checks from New York (the financiers Roger Altman, Ronald Perelman and Donald Trump each gave $50,000); Silicon Valley ($50,000 from Steve Jobs); and especially Southern California, where Emanuel’s brother, Ari, a powerful Hollywood agent, raised money on his behalf. David Geffen gave $100,000, Steven Spielberg $75,000.
JayD
There are interesting assumptions in your last post: “American anger put Obama in the oval office – not democrats. Sure we want to go there again? If Daniels isn’t your choice (not sure he’s mine either), there are others. At this critical moment we absolutely need OMB types (like Ryan) managing the books. And we can all thank the democrats for shooting New Age statism in its collective foot! Obamacare was just enough of an overreach that it mobilized taxpayers & jet fueled free-market principles movements.”
First, I don’t see in any of the posts of this thread a preference for Trump as the Repub nominee. There is wistfulness that the establishment candidates aren’t as energized but instead act as if nothing important is at stake (other than self advancement).
Second, I think general anger was evident only in the 2006 election and that was directed at Bush43’s autopilot second term and the business as usual approach to Iraq as well as GOP corruption/ overspending. How do you contend that anger was evident in 2008? Obama ran a cool calm collected campaign specifically renouncing partisanship and demagoguery. Yes it was a sham but most voters didn’t realize it then. There certainly was economic fear and that was what tipped it to Obama. He only got 52% and change.
Third where have I advocated an angry campaign ever? Based on my posts you would know that I believe a POTUS candidate should be a big state governor, Army general or secretary of state. Having said that, I’m not sure even Trump can be accused of running an angry campaign in the sense of dividing American citizens. His focus however theatrically has been on trade swindles and international respect. It’s Obama as prez and the Dems who are doing that.
Fourth, of course there are always multiple candidates to choose from. That’s not the issue. Your assumption seems to be that the 2012 election is in the bag so the Repubs can nominate any nebbish and win comfortably. You may be right although I don’t see that at all. But even so what happens after they win? Will the nebbish win the legislative battles or be rolled? The Dems are not going away if they lose. They control the schools, the courts, the media (mostly). The (Congressional) Repubs have shown little in the way of backbone.
Fifth, having OMB types manage the books is the easy part. You don’t need a prez for that. He or she can hire a thousand brilliant eyeshades. It’s getting the Congress and the voters to agree which is the hard part. That requires communication skills.
Sixth, you seem to believe that leftism is completely discredited now. I wish I shared your confidence. The young people I meet are virtually all anti business and don’t have an unkind thought about government inefficiency or corruption. If I raise the issue, they merely shrug their shoulders and minimize it. They are incensed though about paying a buck more to a business. I agree that there is some weakening among the lower middle class particularly in the flyover states who have been treated with utter contempt by the Dems. That’s where the election will be fought. Having said that don’t you think that Trump’s tirades against China etc might resonate there in the primaries?
JayD, This IS the greatest country that ever was and god help us to keep it that way. Yeah others flock here still but the way things are going right now we are on a trajectory away from our founders vision.
Back to the OP, Trump is a game changer.. he has all the right enemies including the gop’s clucking hens on the hill. Trump is winning acceptance among unlikely conservatives who have lost faith in their own party that repeatedly parades phony conservative representatives.
Trump is no conservative as I call em but he is taking the top spot right now because he understands what most people care about and has the means to deliver the messages they want to believe in and that is likely that gop voters might compromise their own principles this time and nominate any candidate capable of winning just to ensure Obama is not a 2 term potus. Is this distraction good for conservative causes in the near term? Yes me thinks. Why? Because it is aggravating beaureaucrats of every stripe who are desperately trying to find their way to better poll numbers while campaigning within their means.
Trump and his minions are exploiting the birthcert “movement” among anti-Obama dem, independent and gop to differentiate themselves from Obama solely on policy grounds.. And, If the gop does not like it they can kiss his royal anti Obama billionaire’s hiney. Remember, this was Obama’s strategy, be the most anti Bush early on and turn up the heat in the primary. Pure genius JayD, and it worked didn’t it.
Ross Perot was entertaining but he lost is many ways. Yet few people that have run since had the experience from walking the walk in the global business community. Trump may not be your idea of entertaining but that is what politics has been reduced to for now, although recent congressional horror flicks aint my cup o tea.
And JayD, From the core of my soul I do believe America is the greatest country on earth ever but we will not remain withouthonoring our founders vision. Obama has pulled off the dream of communists which every day drives a dagger deeper into our constitution. Yes, it is that serious.
Valentinus, sincere apologies offered for any erroneous assumptions. My points were intended to note: 1) Trump polled at 3%, with lackluster press attention, before this birther nonsense. And whether/not the child is 4 (or 64!), one should never reward bad behavior with attention.
2) Untempered anxiety & anger results (most of the time) in really, REALLY lousy decision-making. When McCain lined up w/ Bush on the bailout, it was game-over; he confirmed the majority’s perception (“perception = reality”) he was co-complicit and more of the same. Enough Republicans joined w/ lots of Independents – all angry at DC’s spending – and the GOP was forced to do a massive public mea culpa, serious re-branding, and call this junior representative “Mr. President” shortly after Nov ’08.
Will Trump’s tirades against China etc. resonate in the flyover states? Consider:
~ Imposing tariffs on Chinese imports to offset currency undervaluation is of highly questionable WTO legality.
~ In ’09, small and medium businesses (SMEs) accounted for 97.6 percent of all U.S. exporters.
~ From ‘92–‘09, the number of SMEs exporting to China surged by 776 % (compared to 167 % for large-company exporters).
~ In ’10, China was the 3rd largest market for US goods and on track to exceed ‘09 numbers by $20 billion & increase China exports by another 450% since 2000.
~ Export supported jobs represent 7% of all US employment and 1/5th of all US manufacturing jobs.
~ SMEs represent 99.7 percent of all employer firms; employ over 50% of all private sector employees; Pay 44% of total U.S. private payroll; have generated 64 % of net new jobs over the past 15 years; create more than 50% of non-farm private GDP; and hire 40 percent of all high tech workers (i.e. scientists, engineers, and computer programmers).
Additionally, 92% of SMEs work from a single US location and are, therefore, almost completely dependent upon government initiatives to open up foreign markets (unlike larger firms w/ offshore affiliates). If we kill off export growth to China – which Trump ‘policies’ would do – who suffers? Export growth is leading the US economic recovery and trade with China is the fastest growing export destination in the Midwest. Ergo, I’m thinking highly doubtful the Donald’s China rants will resonate in flyover states.
Turbo, Trump’s impact (if any) on general election results would likely be as another spoiler. As you note, Perot led in the presidential polls, but in the end … gave us Bill Clinton. I never would doubt your core, patriotism, or love of country ~ only your wavering confidence, faith in our people, and optimism. If America survived Jimmy Carter, we can durn sure survive Obama. I just don’t want us (the GOP) to add more stupid to the mix and wind up stuck with him for another 4!
JayD, I do not think we will be stuck with Trump. What he will do is force discussions that otherwise have not or will not otherwise take place.
If Trump can bat a .400 then drop back and support an electable republican that is more conservative than Obama, he wins. If he backs out completely his brand suffers. He will come out ahead by putting a winning candidate in the limelight. Frankly I cannot imagine he wants to deal with the BS of being an elected leader.. he is too much his own man and enjoys the good life..
If the GOP fielded REAL conservatives with REAL world industrial experience in the manufacturing sector or some relavent private industry, not just another lawyer, then Trump would not toot his horn so loud. If only we had some sobering program like alcoholics have for the gop.. Say Republicans Anonymous, then Trump would not waste his time. So, until we have strong willed experienced candidates that are not just another politician who knows how to work the establishment and has the $$ and access to the campaign experts, Trump will stay in the game. After he drops out later, we may thank him..
It looks like the Donald is working down his “In” Box on Obama with a lot of ammunition remaining in his arsenal…
• Obama’s Original vault copy of Certificate of Live Birth in the USA: Donald’s “birther” claim
• Certificate of Live Birth — Released
• Fransiskus Assisi School School application — Released
• Selective Service Registration — Released – Controversial….
• Harvard Law Review articles — None (maybe 1, Not Signed)
• Obama/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Soetoro/Dunham marriage license — Not released
• Soetoro adoption records — Not released
• Punahou School records — Not released
• Occidental College records — Not released
• Passport (Pakistan) — Not released
• Columbia College records — Not released
• Columbia thesis — Not released
• Harvard College records — Not released
• Baptism certificate — None
• Medical records — Not released
• Illinois State Senate records — None (Locked up to prohibit public view)
• Illinois State Senate schedule — Lost (All other Illinois state senators’ records are intact)
• Law practice client list — Not released
• University of Chicago scholarly articles – None
Today he whacked the Obama campaign with the “not released” Columbia and Harvard records with his latest quip that: “Barack Obama had been a poor student who did not deserve to be admitted to the Ivy League universities he attended.” When is the Obama campaign going to play the racist card in what appears right now to be the only campaign poker game in play??
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hLwU-RlIyzUA_sZCs1KLt6WiKmCA?docId=292f4280ef89473ca40a7329ce4cc829
Who cares about Trump? Let’s work for the best President for the next election. I pick McDonnell. I will work till my bones are dry to get him elected. Bob’s for jobs and the economy!
Kathy, this Trump fella is youtube gold right now. The work he is doing is the work few others could do and get away with while sitting in office. Why this all matters is that someone will win the primary and a growing list of dems have reason to second guess their front runner.
Let it go Turbo; let it go!
IF Trump releases his financials (required by law I believe w/in 30 days of announcing his candidacy), the news reports will be the man who says he can get things done because of his terrific business skills is also the same guy that, “In 2004, lost majority control of his casino business under a bankruptcy restructuring plan. And in Feb. 2009, Trump Entertainment Resorts filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy and Trump quit (was fired??) as chairman of that company, which had total assets of $2.06 billion and total debts of $1.74 billion. Also around that same time, nine ADDITIONAL Trump Entertainment associated companies filed for bankruptcy protection, including Trump Taj Majal Associates, Trump Marina Associates and Trump Plaza Associates.” [CNN]
Born rich, but spends all his time talking about how much he’s worth and how hard he worked for his wealth? Let’s see … “greedy, tacky, self-centered, perpetually in the midst of a divorce, apparently unable to say anything displaying the slightest intelligence” – AND an expert at divesting debt through bankruptcy.
Yet somehow you think he’s valuable to the GOP brand because … he’ll keep democrats guessing about the President’s birth location????
JayD,
Trump is not directly valuable to the Repubs but he is damaging to Obama precisely because he has never been associated with partisan politics in the past. He reaches large numbers of people who fall asleep the minute some Repub starts talking (and I mean all the current candidates). These people have mostly been insulated by the MSM and its acolytes from all unfiltered critiques of Obama and the Dems. It is surprising to them that Trump has such blistering criticism of Obama and he starts them thinking in a way that Romney et al never would. As for the business details you cite, Forbes apparently thinks he’s a billionaire and the public thinks he’s rich and successful because he has a TV show. That line of criticism is a nonstarter. As BK and JR assert, Repubs will have do a lot better than that to block him within the party.
V – the question isn’t HOW MUCH is in Trump’s piggy bank; honestly, who really cares? HOW it got there, OTOH, plus his numerous bankruptcies, shady deals, shady business partners and predatory development practices DO matter. Collectively, the facts undermine the foundation (and veracity!) of WHY he says he’s qualified to lead.
Re: reaching the sleepwalkers ~ it ain’t happening. MSNBC viewers are laughing at Mr. Comb-over … AND the GOP.
Now that Ron Paul has thrown in, perhaps he’ll bring enough excitement in these pre-pre primary days to appease the base.
JayD, Valentinus gets it! The last paragraph you wrote is a main point for a Trump candidacy. Trump excites well beyond any base that would not otherwise tune in nor leave the channel where it is if Paul, Romney etc were to appear. People cannot help themselves but to watch and listen when Trump is on AND agree with him or not, they listen and remember. They don’t care about bankruptcies if their pliable minds are entertained in TV land. Trump is a master of media imprinting and his appearances boost ratings undeniably.
http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/04/the_chord_donald_trump_strikes.html
Great link, Turbo. Trump has tapped a rich political oil well that Obama is trying to catch on fire. Maybe Obama can thwart a political disaster by applying the experience he gained by his decisive handling of the Deepwater Horizon.
Perhaps we have “The Donald” to thank after all. He won’t get elected our next POTUS but he has made many think about their silly choice to hire Obama on the first round.
Occam’s Razor at work.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor
Let’s not forget.. The birther movement was brought up by Hillary supporters.. liberals no less.
Ha Ha Turbo. The KISS principle usually does apply. Hillary supporters did start the birther movement but it didn’t get her elected did it?
Kathy, I don’t think he is trying to get elected..
News Flash.. Birth cert is released.. Trump wins round 1
http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2011/04/27/president-obamas-long-form-birth-certificate for all to see now we can move on to more important things.
lol.. Potus is doing damage control now.. It’s sunlight shining on that city on the hill..
I don’t know about the released birth certificate. One of my graphics guys brought up the pdf in Adobe Illustrator, separated the layers, and the green patterned background is a separate layer containing the lines, letters are missing from the text… i.e. “R” in “BARACK”, dates, certification signature, and many others which makes it look like a composite of a lot of different graphics components. Maybe we aren’t using Illustrator correctly, but if someone else could do this to verify what we are seeing, let us know where we are going wrong.
I was born in Honolulu, Hawaii. Both his long and short forms look just like mine. As far as I am concerned, he was born in Honolulu, Hawaii.
Time to move on. Why beat a dead horse ?
Why, that sunlight is shining brighter than ever on that city on the hill.. Heavens it sure is getting hot at 16th & penn. And I bet some heads roll over this.
When this is all over Trump will drop out but somewhere there is a candidate keeping his/her powder dry preparing to take on the leviathan.. and that person will thank Trump for his service to our country in his own way.
Onward to the college transcripts and childhood friendships.. http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/04/27/trump_to_obama_now_release_your_college_records.html
Great – now Obama’s birth certificate is public, right-wing nuts are moving on to affirmative action. This crap is from YOUR link, Turbo, not mine:
“One thing the political class seems to have forgotten is that there are few living white Americans who have not had some personal experience with an affirmative-action co-worker and/or collegiate peer. For decades now, we Mainstreet dwellers have borne the brunt of this liberal two-wrongs-really-can-make-a-right folderol, and now we stand, mouths agape at those who still pretend this isn’t what happened in 2008. Awarding the pinnacle of world power to a guy on the basis of eternally-aggrieved skin color is quintessentially anti-American and the people know it. It was playing with fire and we’re getting burned. The people know this. The people are saying it in private. But the narrative needs to be shown to be shaky at best, questionable in the least and that perhaps Obama got his symbolic “first black president” creds on faulty premises.
Tim J ~ Any graphics guy knows how to flatten image (merge layers) before output – if the intent is deception. And show me ANY typed on typewriter document and I’ll show you light/dark letters. Let it go.
A military officer went to the brig all because the POTUS was playing some juvenile game. If there had at least been embarraasing info on the BC form there might have been an excuse for this infantile behavior from the Commander in Chief. Any normal person whatever they thought of the officer would have ended the matter before it began. Any normal person would have produced the form back in 2008.
All I can say is that the POTUS has disgraced the office with his behavior.
And the WH admin may have embarrassed themselves.. looks like a politically correct forgery in many ways. In 1961 white people were typically identified as caucasian while black people were typically identified as black, negro or colored. No I am not making offensive statements, just reflecting on the norms of that era..
http://www.facebook.com/#!/photo.php?fbid=217398381606635&set=a.102863456393462.6016.100000094247661&type=1&theater
Also, the pdf is so easy to dissect even a 5th grader could do it..
This does not appear to be over.
Valentinus, this is our POTUS explanation of why he finally gave the long form Birth Certificate. I agree with you. If he was a President who cared about unity of all Americans, and saw a fraction who needed “proof” and cared about ALL Americans, he would have done this in 2008 (when Hillary supporters were raising a stink about it), not waited until now to “care” about healing division. With that said, he’s been President now for almost a year and a half. It’s time to move on.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2011/04/27/remarks-president
The White House
Office of the Press Secretary
For Immediate Release
April 27, 2011
Remarks by the President
James S. Brady Press Briefing Room
9:48 A.M. PDT
THE PRESIDENT: Hello, everybody. Now, let me just comment, first of all, on the fact that I can’t get the networks to break in on all kinds of other discussions — (laughter.) I was just back there listening to Chuck — he was saying, it’s amazing that he’s not going to be talking about national security. I would not have the networks breaking in if I was talking about that, Chuck, and you know it.
Q Wrong channel. (Laughter.)
THE PRESIDENT: As many of you have been briefed, we provided additional information today about the site of my birth. Now, this issue has been going on for two, two and a half years now. I think it started during the campaign. And I have to say that over the last two and a half years I have watched with bemusement, I’ve been puzzled at the degree to which this thing just kept on going. We’ve had every official in Hawaii, Democrat and Republican, every news outlet that has investigated this, confirm that, yes, in fact, I was born in Hawaii, August 4, 1961, in Kapiolani Hospital.
We’ve posted the certification that is given by the state of Hawaii on the Internet for everybody to see. People have provided affidavits that they, in fact, have seen this birth certificate. And yet this thing just keeps on going.
Now, normally I would not comment on something like this, because obviously there’s a lot of stuff swirling in the press on at any given day and I’ve got other things to do. But two weeks ago, when the Republican House had put forward a budget that will have huge consequences potentially to the country, and when I gave a speech about my budget and how I felt that we needed to invest in education and infrastructure and making sure that we had a strong safety net for our seniors even as we were closing the deficit, during that entire week the dominant news story wasn’t about these huge, monumental choices that we’re going to have to make as a nation. It was about my birth certificate. And that was true on most of the news outlets that were represented here.
And so I just want to make a larger point here. We’ve got some enormous challenges out there. There are a lot of folks out there who are still looking for work. Everybody is still suffering under high gas prices. We’re going to have to make a series of very difficult decisions about how we invest in our future but also get a hold of our deficit and our debt — how do we do that in a balanced way.
And this is going to generate huge and serious debates, important debates. And there are going to be some fierce disagreements — and that’s good. That’s how democracy is supposed to work. And I am confident that the American people and America’s political leaders can come together in a bipartisan way and solve these problems. We always have.
But we’re not going to be able to do it if we are distracted. We’re not going to be able to do it if we spend time vilifying each other. We’re not going to be able to do it if we just make stuff up and pretend that facts are not facts. We’re not going to be able to solve our problems if we get distracted by sideshows and carnival barkers.
We live in a serious time right now and we have the potential to deal with the issues that we confront in a way that will make our kids and our grandkids and our great grandkids proud. And I have every confidence that America in the 21st century is going to be able to come out on top just like we always have. But we’re going to have to get serious to do it.
I know that there’s going to be a segment of people for which, no matter what we put out, this issue will not be put to rest. But I’m speaking to the vast majority of the American people, as well as to the press. We do not have time for this kind of silliness. We’ve got better stuff to do. I’ve got better stuff to do. We’ve got big problems to solve. And I’m confident we can solve them, but we’re going to have to focus on them — not on this.
Thanks very much, everybody.
Jay D… Who should have “Flattened” the PDF image from whitehouse.gov?
Mythbusted: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7lS7dGwYjI&feature=player_embedded
Wish it away all you want but this is here and it is relavant to the letter of the constitution.
If the potus was born at Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital and according to his certificate in spite of the fact that the name of the hospital location referenced at the time of his birth was Kauikeolani Children’s Hospital, how could that be so? Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital did not exist on record because it was Kauikeolani Children’s Hospital.. which in 1978 merged with Kapiolani Maternity Home. Can’t make this stuff up.
Turbo, Note the date below.
From a 1969 Journal of Obstetrical Gynecology article
Antepartum cervical cerclage operations.Analysis at Kapiolani Maternity and Gynecological Hospital from 1957 through 1966.
Facilities can have all kinds of divisional and corporate names simultaneously. The name you reference for 1978 is not the same as follows: The two hospitals joined in 1978 to become Kapi‘olani Medical Center for Women & Children.
Accept the fact that the POTUS is an emotionally immature American. Americans can be that.
The whole claim make people look like fools… The man said he was born in America and I never doubted him anymore than I did Clinton, Bush 1 and 2, Ford or Carter. As American’s we don’t have to prove anything to anyone. We are all Americans and if you have a problem with that, its yours to own.
As for clearing this up and our “Thanks” to Trump, I only hope that nut is the GOP’s candidate. LOL
Yes, Tim J ~ whitehouse.gov – or ANYONE who wants to ‘tweak’ a document – needs only rudimentary PhotoShop skills. Even a PS novice knows the process: scan document; upload into PS; make your changes; flatten layers; save as tiff, jpg, pdf, etc. After ‘flatten’ & save, it’s impossible to revert or re-separate digital file back to pre-flattened state … that specific file info has been dumped; it’s gone forever. Your layer hunt to disprove authenticity is a real stretch of the imagination; your “graphics guys” should know this, too. (If you don’t believe me, have one of them show you the process.)
Seriously, if you guys really can’t let this one go, might I suggest a long vacation (away from politics and the ‘net), a new hobby, or a good therapist? Life is too damn short to get sucked up in this nonsense.
Jay D… I’ll take you at your word since you seem to be an expert at this and my folks are busy with paying clients. It appears as though there are thousands of YouTube and Facebook entries since yesterday which have promoted the new birth certificate to the level of an Urban Legend conspiracy.
Here is another conspiracy.. The certificate says his father was from Kenya. Kenya was not a country for 2-3 yrs after Obama was born and there are as of yet no other reported birth certificates in the us listing Kenya before 1962.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenya
Can’t make this stuff up.
And no I am not a birther, just appreciate honesty, integrity and accurate information from my president.
The way this has been handled by the WH makes me laugh hard and cut a 12 octave fart.. damn, I need a cigar and some vino right about now.
Kenya was the name of the British colony from the 1920s. There probably were very few African Kenyans floating around the US before the 60s. The Mau Mau rebellion was going on for most of the 50s. Caucasian Kenyans would have self listed as British subjects I’m sure.
Quite frankly I think it is far worse that the POTUS used this for a juvenile political game for 3 years spending millions of dollars and ruining the career of one or more military officers than if he had made it up.
FYI: Wikipedia is not a factual resource to quote… LOL
William,
I’m sure Wikipedia is superior to the sources you use.
With the war comment, I think what he is getting at is that you don’t go to war with someone over ideology, you do it because you are gonna get something out of it for YOUR nation. This is the mind of a true Excecutive. He uses flat truths to get the point across in terms of absolutes and it has impact. He would be a great president, unfortunately a lot of people don’t want an executive for president, they want a figure head that makes them feel good.
Back to the OP.. sorta..
Someone please enlighten me about people wondering where someone is born = bigotry?
I just love how some of you people (libs) throw “bigotry” and “racism” around as a term without a specific meaning and in the end, it is you people who actually demean those who REALLY suffered. In Wisconsin Richard Trumpka said that the “struggle” there was like the civil rights fight… yea, sleeping in the capital building for four weeks with dominos pizza and cell phones is pretty similar to decades of injustice, slavery, segregation, separate counters/water fountains, lynchings, etc… How people don’t see that they are insulting the true victims of bigotry and racism when they make these comments is beyond me. How they then also try to claim to be so intellectually superior to everyone wondering what the truth is about a US presidents true proven identity is even more baffling.
Yeah the issues are more important but the basics such as this still matter now and will have to be better handled in the future. Trump did us a huge service not as party or ideology but as a troubled country facing bankruptcy.. Just my $0.02
William Bailey I’m sure you are hoping Trump is the GOP candidate. Not happening.
Bump.. http://thepage.time.com/2010/10/13/christie-trump-double-team-for-nrsc/
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